August 18, 2007
Adventures In Wingnuttery
By Randy Paul of Beautiful Horizons
Let me be clear. I really can't stand Charles Krauthammer, but my heart goes out to him for the fact that he is confined to a wheelchair for the rest of his life due to a diving accident. I couldn't stand Ronald Reagan, but I feel for him and his family for enduring the ravages of Alzheimer's disease. I detested Michael Kelly, but I feel for his survivors for losing someone they loved so young.
That being said, one can only wonder what sort of twisted, demented, scabrous soul would refer to Max Cleland as "Stumpy," simply because they disagreed with his politics.
I wish this person would call Cleland that to his face and perhaps in front of his own (the demented one's) children. One wonders what limits of common decency some people avoid putting on themselves.
A diving accident? Along with you, I do feel sympathy for Krauthammer (although I had always assumed it was something like childhood polio or something). A diving accident suggests a certain lack of care or common sense. I certainly wouldn't wish a lifetime of disability on a young man for a momentary lack of common sense, but Max Clelland's was a combat injury incurred while serving his country.
Posted by: sb | Aug 18, 2007 11:55:23 PM
"I wish this person would call Cleland that to his face and perhaps in front of his own (the demented one's) children."
My guess is this lowlife would do this without flinching. In the era of Ann Coulter very little surprises me from the wingnuttery.
Posted by: jncam | Aug 19, 2007 12:18:32 AM
You're a tremendous asshole.
Posted by: Alex | Aug 19, 2007 12:19:09 AM
somewhat OT, but what is the deal with bloggers at mu.nu and utter stupidity? purported heterosexual ace o'spades and treasonindefenseofslavery yankee are based there, as is the repulsive creature referred to above.
what galls me more than the idea that you can call someone that, even if only in blog comments, is that he lost his Senate seat to someone who avoided his military service due to a "trick knee."
Posted by: paul | Aug 19, 2007 12:25:35 AM
A diving accident?
A diving accident? Heck, I thought he was just old and ugly. I had no idea he was paralyzed.
Posted by: qusan | Aug 19, 2007 1:16:21 AM
Um, at the risk of sounding like a huge asshole, I've always thought that Krauthammer's psychotic neoconservatism had a lot to do with his being a cripple. Projection, you know, man I wish I could walk again, I wish I could be vigorous and manly like those soldiers, so I'll support every war and in a certain sense I too can stride along with them as they capture Baghdad.
You're a fucking cripple and that sucks. Deal with it and stop playing a non-trivial part in causing the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people.
Posted by: Random Dude | Aug 19, 2007 1:42:20 AM
Random Dude: normally, that would be a bit harsh, but given Krauthammer's tic of issuing psychiatric diagnoses from afar -- he was calling Democrats clinically insane, with the supposed auspices of a medical degree, long before Frist was declaring Terri Schiavo hale and hearty -- I'll let you off.
As for the munu-wingnuts: they're just a special brand of wingnut sick, theInternet Tough Guy.
Posted by: pseudonymous in nc | Aug 19, 2007 3:07:36 AM
one can only wonder what sort of twisted, demented, scabrous soul would refer to Max Cleland as "Stumpy," simply because they disagreed with his politics
If you start wondering about what kind of people post comments at blogs, you end up with a lot to wonder about.
A diving accident suggests a certain lack of care or common sense.
Um, at the risk of sounding like a huge asshole
You were right to see the risk, but you went ahead anyway.
Posted by: Sanpete | Aug 19, 2007 3:34:15 AM
Sanpete: Hear, hear. Bravo.
Posted by: litbrit | Aug 19, 2007 8:26:27 AM
It's sad that you, Random Dude, would attribute someone's misguided political beliefs to the fact that they are handicapped. And it's sad that Pseuydonymous would "let off" Random after he calls him a "fucking cripple." And it's pretty goddamn sad that one of my favorite blogs has commenters who would say such horrible things. Truly, shame on you people.
Posted by: Media Glutton | Aug 19, 2007 9:52:56 AM
I don't feel sympathy for those who are incapable of it and in the process hurt others. I feel it for those whom they hurt. It's this faux liberal bleeding heart crap that allows the GOP to play you for a sucker.
Posted by: akaison | Aug 19, 2007 10:28:39 AM
By the way- I wouldn't call them names either, but sympathy? Please. Save it for those who deserve it.
Posted by: akaison | Aug 19, 2007 10:29:47 AM
That almost sounds like a sarcastic comment--one that is in poor taste, but one that isn't serious nevertheless.
Posted by: Brian | Aug 19, 2007 10:44:58 AM
Random Dude, which it is tempting to psychoanalyze Krauthammer from afar, because he has no qualms about doing so, plenty of people who are paralyzed do not old such morally odious views as Krauthammer does, and plenty of people who are not handicapped do display his sort of behavior (eg, the Internet Tough Guy, as referenced above).
As far as having sympathy for him? The time for sympathy was in the aftermath of his accident. He seems to have moved on. We should, too. And he wouldn't give a second thought to calling us all deranged, evil human beings for saying that we shouldn't have invaded Iraq and that Bush is a major screwup or deserved to be turned out of office.
Posted by: Tyro | Aug 19, 2007 10:53:59 AM
It's the same old woulda,coulda,shoulda conundrum.
That, for example, Tony Snow has peritoneal mets from his colon Ca is something
that I would assiduously NOT wish on him.
It might occur to me to want to have it happen but I would always put the bad thought impulse away...
because it degrades ME. And what if there were ..magic?
I would never ever even consider sowing such 'evil' growths in him even if I could...no matter the man.
Pol Pot or Hitler even
I despise the creature...for all the overt evil he has done...
the lies the enabling the coverups the equivocations the ...
[For the fact that he SEEMS so nice but underneath...]
But that he DOES have these metastases entirely without
any input, either emotional, mental or actual, from me ..at all
is a fact that really totally fails to make me sad or unhappy....at all.
Not wishing that he suffer, he is still not due my (any?) sympathy.
Same for the monster in the wheelchair...not my doing, not my wishing ...just is.
Don't get me started on Rove or Cheney.
Posted by: has_te | Aug 19, 2007 11:13:44 AM
The reason for not attacking Krauthammer or Cleland for their physical disbilities, for those unmoved by claims of sympathy and civility, is what it reveals about the corruption of one's own perspective.
Such comments dehumanize by reducing the individual's significance down to the fact of their physical condition. It's nothing more than verbal and psychological bullying motivated by the desire to inflict maximum personal injury and emotional pain. Such comments are, in a word, sadistic.
Posted by: WB Reeves | Aug 19, 2007 11:15:03 AM
Can I ask a point of clarification? The odious "Woody" is, I am assuming, an anonymous poster on Marc Cooper's website?
Or, is "Woody" Cooper's tag when he responds to his posters?
I am hoping it is the former, not the latter...
oh, and for these anonymous blog insults and the cretins who make them, I would bet my entire monthly paycheck that someone who does this kind of thing on a reg basis would NEVER have the balls to say any of this shit in person. Just goes with the archtype...nerdy, asthmatic, resentment...and cowardly.
Posted by: thepersianslipper | Aug 19, 2007 11:16:13 AM
It's the former, rest assured.
What WBReeves said,in fact he nailed it.
Posted by: Randy Paul | Aug 19, 2007 11:45:05 AM
I am not saying that one should use someone's disability or factor in. I am saying the opposite. I am saying I am neither going to use it or have sypathy over it because its irrelevant to what they did and will do. It won't sway me one way or the other. That's the point.
Posted by: akaison | Aug 19, 2007 12:02:59 PM
And it's sad that Pseuydonymous would "let off" Random after he calls him a "fucking cripple."
Um, let me spell it out.
I was giving Random a pass for his attributing Krauthammer's mean streak to his paralysis, because cod-psychiatric diagnoses are Krauthammer's stock in trade. I don't like 'fucking cripple'. It's ugly language.
But sometimes, just sometimes, it's worth untying the hand that liberals strap behind their backs when arguing with wingnuts of that particular stripe, just to show that it's still there. Sometimes you have to make it clear that wingnuts aren't special because they have an id and they're prepared to use it to empower themselves. Sometimes you need to kick the bully in the shins.
(And for the record, there's published research on paralysis affecting the capacity for emotional response, because the conscious brain doesn't have the same autonomic nervous activity to assist in processing fear/joy, etc. It's also mentioned here.)
Posted by: pseudonymous in nc | Aug 19, 2007 3:53:45 PM
Sometimes you need to kick the bully in the shins.
The way to do that is with truthful arguments made forcefully and well, not an imitation of what you're ostensibly opposed to.
The science discussed at your link doesn't support the accusations made above.
Posted by: Sanpete | Aug 19, 2007 5:30:50 PM
Can I be Freudianly amused by this turn of phrase from Charles Krauthammer's son Daniel, though?
The great conflicts we faced with fascism and nazism were not won with peace talks or compromise or appeasement. They were won by standing up to evil, calling it by its name and fighting it until victory.
(via The Good Roger Alies)
Posted by: DonBoy | Aug 19, 2007 11:32:47 PM
I don't think it's a stretch to posit that Krauthammer's infirmity has had an effect on his world view. I don't even think it's irrresponsible. In fact, to not suggest such a connection would be irresponsible.
Posted by: binny | Aug 20, 2007 8:55:59 AM
It may not be a stretch to posit such a connection but it certainly is a stretch to treat that speculation as an established fact and to elaborate upon it. It is the height of irresponsibility to elevate spiteful assumptions to the level of factual criticism. It is also the classic ad hominem: "Of course Krauthammer would think that. He's a cripple!"
So how did FDR's paralysis link to his politics? We could speculate but who's willing to claim that his Polio was the touchstone of his political views?
Posted by: WB Reeves | Aug 20, 2007 10:54:29 AM
IIRC, there are some political commentators who linked FDR's compassion to his polio. But armchair psychoanalysis is often lazy thinking; there's a lot more to a person's personality than their physical state alone, for one thing.
And to join in the chorus: sb, you're an asshole.
Posted by: Persia | Aug 20, 2007 11:40:32 AM
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