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June 14, 2006
Radio Klein
Spent an hour last night arguing with George Lakoff on Chris Lydon's radio show. The debate, about what constitutes an ideology and whether or not the blogs have one, was actually pretty interesting. You can listen to it here.
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You were really good. Lakoff is a snob.
Posted by: Sam L. | Jun 14, 2006 11:33:32 AM
You did do well. I think you and Lakoff were both right--there is a presumed set of core values, but given that the goal isn't ideological rigor but (as you say) political success. Lakoff did come off as kind of arrogant.
Posted by: Tom Hilton | Jun 14, 2006 1:23:54 PM
Lakoff is a big snob, yep. But his splash into politics has been pretty unfairly categorized as what you called the 'name n frame game', and he's right that the overarching worldview thing is more important.
You came off great, and the 'Net people support Muscular candidates, not hard lefties', was a great addition.
I've never heard a rightwing blogger on radio or tv who wasn't a snob and pettier than a 12 year old kid, too, so Lakoff's academic-snobbery comes off better in its light. The more radio and tv that well-spoken lefty bloggers like yourself do with assholes like Hugh Hewitt and Instapundit, the more we'll win arguments. Our words/frames/blah blah have been so artificially repressed that when they come up on TV, like occasionally on the Daily Show or by Robert Reich (who does God's work on the otherwise ridiculous pap on CNBC, Kudlow Country), that they really work when they land.
That's the one thing I kinda fear, that just like how the big media stations have tried to beat the bloggers by inaccurately calling them young, radical PJ wearers, they'll start letting more smart progressives get on TV (where many people will see them for the 1st time) but restrict them to talking about relatively cold framing issues like this. I dunno any hard numbers about who watches CNN, MSNBC, etc., but even if you're at your most articulate, it'd be a rigged contrast to have someone like the rightwing Mary and you on TV together, with you doing the grunt work of speaking aloud the 'government can be good, no really!' set of terms and facts, with her just giving the usual Party Line and tweaking the 'sports team rivalry' pettiness you mentioned in the interview.
There's just so much info suppressed - and I don't mean conspiracy theory stuff, just basic facts like what you spend your time elaborating with Healthcare or Max Sawicky and Dean Baker of EPI do with Social Security and the Estate tax, that with almost assuredly unsympathetic hosts (save Keith Olbermann I guess) it'll be tough to crack through. Makes it all more clear of the importance of finding muscular candidates so that the TV people are forced to not confine the building 'smart progressive' viewpoint to a few stacked panel sessions on, say, Hardball.
Chris Lydon mentioned Bopnews too! Do you know Matt Stoller well? He seemed to get some good spotlight in YearlyKos, and now Stirling Newberry's muscling in on Matthew Yglesias' turf in TPM Cafe. You and Matt need to up your under-30 media figure game with more great interviews like these.
Posted by: Tim | Jun 14, 2006 1:39:42 PM
I noticed something different about your (Ezra's)comments and those of the right-wing blogger they had on: She was very careful, when answering any of Chris' questions, to include unfavorable characterizations, sometimes subtle, and sometimes not, of the other side (us). This is something the right is very disciplined about, and is why they are so good at exploiting tribalism. Every single comment she had about Kos, the left blogosphere, whatever had not only a pro-right, but an anti-left spin. It was evidence in a way for Lakoff's insistence on the importance of language - the rightwing blogger implied that Instapundit, etc "encouraged independent bloggers" while the left blogosphere was top down - this is a classic rightwing frame of equating liberalism to command economy, hive-mind, coercion, etc. I think you (Ezra) did very well on the show, but my one complaint is that you let her get away with too much of this, and particularly that you let her make it sound like *you said* that the participants of YK didn't have ideas. I know that's not what you meant, but she reframed your own comments and it was allowed to stand. Vigilance is required when making media appearances with these people.
Open source is a great show, btw.
Posted by: cerebrocrat | Jun 14, 2006 11:58:55 PM
