« The Wonk Takes Over | Main | How Much Does Trade Matter? »

June 10, 2005

Just a Thought

As a fellow attendee of the Edwards dinner, I'd argue that revoking the posting privileges of folks who criticize him on your site is probably not the best way to look as if you exited the meal with integrity intact.  Even if Stirling had other reasons for banning BOP News poster RJ Eskow and deleting all his old pieces doing it directly after RJ posted something critical of John Edwards is about as bad as optics get. 

When Stirling tipped Garance off about the dinner, she wrote:

Gaining the loyalty of bloggers...is not that hard to do if you just talk to them

In my eyes, that made us all look bad, in addition to being a load of crap. But who knows, maybe Garance put her finger directly on the problem.  As bloggers begin to get courted by more pols and bigger names, we're going to have to figure out some way to deal with the attention without looking -- without being! -- hopelessly compromised.  Maybe that means full disclosure of every meal and conversation, though, like in journalism, I fear that won't work.  After all, how many bloggers, if asked to an off-the-record dinner (which the Edwards dinner wasn't, by the way) with Hillary Clinton or Brian Schweitzer would cheerfully decline, citing online ethics?  We want the access too much to deny it.  Indeed, it's happpening now.  The Edwards dinner was by no means first, there have been a slew of meet and greets, meals, drinks, conventions and conference calls that various groups of bloggers have attended, and it'll only get worse from here.  How to deal with it, I don't know.  But Stirling's actions, innocent or not, reflect badly on all of our credibility.

June 10, 2005 in Weblogs | Permalink

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
http://www.typepad.com/t/trackback/19450/2622703

Listed below are links to weblogs that reference Just a Thought:

Comments

Just the simple fact that you will engage in these "meet and greets", dinners, etc. will make you vulnerable to the same criticism as the mainstream. In fact, it will make you mainstream and you will lose the appearance of independence.

Welcome to the grownup world.

Posted by: Robert Zimmerman | Jun 10, 2005 11:23:34 AM

Just the simple fact that you will engage in these "meet and greets", dinners, etc. will make you vulnerable to the same criticism as the mainstream. In fact, it will make you mainstream and you will lose the appearance of independence.

Welcome to the grownup world.

Posted by: Robert Zimmerman | Jun 10, 2005 11:24:56 AM

In fact, it will make you mainstream and you will lose the appearance of independence

That doesn't make a lick of sense: are you saying that being mainstream is the lack of the APPEARANCE of independence? Or is it the lack of independence per se? You know, of course, that independence or its lack is no binary: no one is sui generis.

That said, banning users who criticize anyone in particular, unless the person's a maniac who repeats the same, baseless charges over and over again, is a bad idea, and thanks EK, for bringing this up in a public forum.

Posted by: Karl the Idiot | Jun 10, 2005 11:39:40 AM

Karl (idiot),
The bloggers have enjoyed a higher level of independence than mainstream because.... well they actually are more independent. No advertising revenue quotas or political allegiances makes them so.
Now, as they move into the world of schmooze and money, why would anyone think this will not change?

As far as your banning comment, you should talk to democraticunderground and other radical sites who engage in this practice regularly.

By the way, nice to see you again, Karl.

Posted by: Robert Zimmerman | Jun 10, 2005 11:48:23 AM

In my eyes, that made us all look bad, in addition to being a load of crap.

I honestly thought she was just joking when I read that.

Posted by: Adrock | Jun 10, 2005 1:15:56 PM

Yeah, welcome to the new world of blogging, when you guys are actually courted from time to time.

I think these new disclosures should also apply to blog commenters. I'm not sure I want to be accused of a "conflict of interest" in any comments. And I certainly don't want Ezra to ban me from posting a comment b/c of my lack of disclosure concerning my whirlwind lifestyle.

As a result and in the spirit of full disclosure, here are my dinners for this week:

Monday: 2 1/2 Gardenburgers, Asparagus. No celebrities were present.

Tuesday: In a hurry, I had three taquitos from Quiktrip, as well as a small sack of Gardettos. Again, no celebrities involved, although the woman at the Quiktrip has a vague resemblance to Tuesday Weld.

Wednesday: I met one of the Baldwin brothers, who is in town filming a movie. I don't remember his name, because there are so many offspring in that family. We did not have dinner. My dinner that night was a steak with a baked potato.

Thursday: NBA Finals. I saw Phil Jackson on tv during my dinner (which consisted of grilled chicken), which I assure you will not cause me to go easy on him in my blogging comments.

Posted by: Chris Rasmussen | Jun 10, 2005 1:27:00 PM

Did anyone see the full text of RJ Eskow's comments?

Posted by: NW Clerk | Jun 10, 2005 1:53:45 PM

Our resident troll/Republican shill is a great one to be warning of the dangers of losing one's independence. Its like learning abstinence from a street whore.

By the way, I think the general assumption has been that Zimmy chose Bob Dylan's birth name as some sort of ironical something or other. But what if it IS his real name. Could he be. . .

"Robert Zimmerman, Senior Vice President

Robert Zimmerman joined DKC as a Senior Vice President. Prior to DKC, Robert was the Vice President for brand promotion at leading worldwide news organization, FOX News. He developed press strategies to support corporate initiatives for FOX News properties, affiliates and international expansion. While at FOX, Robert handled the publicity for Geraldo Rivera and ““On Location with Geraldo Rivera””. He also directed the media campaign for the launch of ““The Radio Factor with Bill O’’Reilly”” in conjunction with Westwood One and supervised publicity for FOX News’’ retail merchandise initiative. Before joining FOX, Robert handled brand development and corporate and entertainment publicity at Edelman Public Relations Worldwide and the Lippin Group. He holds a bachelor of arts from the University of Pennsylvania."

The same Robert Zimmerman who, while with "fair and balanced" Fox had some angry words with the NYT for one of their reporter's describing Fox as "the conservative cable network" (gasp!). . . "It is either the writer's editorial opinion, which should not have been evidence in a news story, or an intentional attempt to mislabel Fox News," spokesman Robert Zimmerman wrote the paper about Alessandra Stanley's piece."

Maybe he has more knowledge about media whoredom than we ever gave him credit.

Posted by: JTN | Jun 10, 2005 2:02:10 PM

Maybe I make valid points, but you would rather pick a personal fight...

Posted by: Robert Zimmerman | Jun 10, 2005 2:34:19 PM

Ezra,

Thanks for raising this as an issue. As anyone knows who's been reading me at Night Light, I know it's complicated and not black-and-white. I'm not condemning people for working on campaigns, or for having access to politicians.

What I do believe is that there's the risk of a slippery slope, that this issue threatens the credibility and nature of the liberal blogging community, and that the behavior of some individuals threatens the credibility of the group. We need to be thoughtful and proactive as a community.

On a personal note, I'm not aware of any other reasons for Stirling Newberry's actions toward me, nor has he offered any. I have posted an open letter to BOP itself - written in the spirit of solidarity in support of a common goal, and expressing hope we can all help the blogging community works through the issues raised by this incident.

I've also written some more thoughts about the complicated issue of access. Hopefully, it recognizes that the issue is complicated and nuanced. If not, I hope you (and others) will tell me so.

(Not trying to "pimp" my writings, as they say, just to offer some clarification of my position Hope it doesn't look that way!)

Posted by: RJ Eskow | Jun 10, 2005 6:12:00 PM

Oh hell, the damned politicians ought to just walk down the street outside of DC and invite random people to dinner. Then they might figure out how out of touch they all are.

Access to politicians SHOULDN'T BE A BIG DEAL AT ALL. It isn't supposed to be. These peeople need to learn to be available to their consituents, the voters, instead of the goddam special interests. Then we might have a chance in this country. Until then, we're all just screwed.

Posted by: donna | Jun 10, 2005 8:43:15 PM

What Donna said. Chill. Politicians are actually human beings who need to bounce ideas around just like anyone else. And for all the bumpf about impartiality, who is going to worry about losing their job blogging ? Self-employed, remember? This may not be the big time quite yet.

Posted by: opit | Jun 11, 2005 3:22:16 AM

What I do believe is that there's the risk of a slippery slope, that this issue threatens the credibility and nature of the liberal blogging community, and that the behavior of some individuals threatens the credibility of the group.

That's pretty much what I said earlier. The only difference is that I did not make my prediction conditional, preface my statements with "thoughtful" preambles and used clearer language. It was designed to get my thoughts across and impressing anyone with the eloquence was secondary. You've been listening to Kerry too much.

Posted by: Robert Zimmerman | Jun 11, 2005 8:57:40 AM

托盘
托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
木制托盘
纸托盘
木塑托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
钢托盘
木托盘
钢制托盘
托盘
塑料托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
南京托盘
南京钢托盘
上海托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
南京托盘
南京钢托盘
上海托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
纸托盘
南京托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘
广州托盘
杭州托盘
成都托盘
武汉托盘
长沙托盘
合肥托盘
苏州托盘
无锡托盘
昆山托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
纸托盘
南京托盘
南京钢制托盘
南京钢托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘

托盘
托盘
托盘
托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
塑料托盘
塑料托盘

托盘
塑料托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
铁托盘
托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘

托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘

托盘
托盘
钢托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
塑料托盘

托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘

托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘
托盘
托盘
托盘
钢托盘
铁托盘
钢制托盘
塑料托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
铁托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
木制托盘
纸托盘
木塑托盘
柱式托盘
波纹托盘
镀锌托盘
南京托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘
广州托盘
托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
铁托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
木制托盘
纸托盘
木塑托盘
柱式托盘
波纹板托盘
镀锌托盘
南京托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘
广州托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
铁托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
木制托盘
纸托盘
木塑托盘
柱式托盘
波纹托盘
镀锌托盘
南京托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘
广州托盘
托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
铁托盘
木托盘
塑料托盘
木塑托盘
柱式托盘
波纹板托盘
镀锌托盘
南京托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘
广州托盘

托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
铁托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
木制托盘
纸托盘
木塑托盘
柱式托盘
波纹托盘
镀锌托盘
南京托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘
广州托盘
托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
铁托盘
塑料托盘
木托盘
纸托盘
木塑托盘
柱式托盘
波纹板托盘
镀锌托盘
南京托盘
上海托盘
北京托盘
广州托盘


托盘
钢托盘
钢制托盘
托盘
塑料托盘

Posted by: peter.w | Sep 16, 2007 10:17:40 PM

ellipsonic decorum canopy hattery laciniolate hesperiidae fernsick gasterothecal
Nancy Chandler Associates
http://www.vinyl2cd.com/

托盘

Posted by: Charmaine Spence | Mar 25, 2008 3:44:19 AM

Post a comment